Jump to content

Talk:Anatoly Sobchak

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Death of Anatoly Sobchak

[edit]

The opening of criminal case (suspected murder) after first expertise has been reported at the time of his death in Russian media. I will try to find it. This reference [1] is not quite accurate. Biophys 23:01, 2 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This reference probably also does not qualify as a reliable source: [http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=19808 Dropping dead at the right moment] Biophys 00:37, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Some Russian language references:

Key paragraph from first reference (Russian): "Как передало СПб-ТАСС, 31 июля и.о.начальника следственного отдела прокуратуры Калининградской области старший советник юстиции Георгий Бугаев сообщил, что уголовное дело, возбужденное по факту смерти в городе Светлогорске Калининградской области экс-мэра Петербурга Анатолия Собчака, будет закрыто 6 августа "за отсутствием события преступления". Дело № 22099 по ст.105 УК РФ было возбуждено прокуратурой Калининградской области 6 мая 2000 года и согласно УПК РФ должно быть расследовано в течение трех месяцев. Как сообщил Бугаев, следствием отрабатывались все версии - от отравления до смерти от переутомления. Было допрошены более 20 свидетелей, проводилась судебно-медицинская экспертиза. Ни одна из версий о насильственной смерти А.Собчака не нашла подтверждения. Судебно-медицинская экспертиза (в том числе гистологическое исследование и анализ крови умершего) опровергла наличие в тканях каких-либо отравляющих веществ и подтвердила отсутствие механических повреждений и каких-либо следов насилия." Thus, the criminal case was indeed opened. The entire story seems to be very murky. Third reference says that Sobchack died three days after drinking a glass of mineral water given to him by Vladimir Putin. But this source (kompromat.ru) is hardly reliable.Biophys 03:29, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Another strange thing: "всю информацию о смерти мэра страшно засекретили. Персоналу гостиницы, где умер Собчак, по сообщению некоторых СМИ, категорически запретили общаться с прессой. Не менее загадочная история и с медэкспертизой. Людмила Нарусова, несмотря на множество слухов, появившихся вокруг этой смерти, отказалась от повторного вскрытия. Она сказала, что вполне доверяет квалификации врачей, которые заявили, что Собчак скончался от обширного инфаркта." So, was the second expertise, or it was not? I am really confused here. Biophys 03:50, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Based on this reference [5], one can conclude that criminal case about death of Sobchak was opened two times: soon after his death and much later. Biophys 17:53, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your contributions. Do you have any references as to how Sobchak is related to Putin (besides common statements about the Law department of the University which don't seem to be enough to explain Putin's career promotion anyway)? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Colchicum (talk • contribs) 20:14, 3 January 2007 (UTC).[reply]
What exactly are you interested in? Some information on Putin's career can be found in the book by P. Klebnikov, Godfather of the Kremlin (p. 293-294, etc.) - not much (Klebnikov was actually an honest person used by FSB to feed him with all kind of disinformation). A lot of info can be found in the book you just inserted: [6]. Putin probably found an important figure in the Yeltsin surrounding who promoted him. I think that was Aleksander Voloshin, who survived much longer than others in the Putin's administration. You can make some research about him. Look this, for example: [7] Biophys 22:36, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

All references are in the Russian language

[edit]

The author (whose native language is obviously Russian) should be complimented for having sufficient command of the English language to write a biographical article about Anatoly Sobchak in English for inclusion in the English language Wikipedia.

Sobchak was a very important, highly influential, Russian university professor and later, city administrator, whose university teachings of the theory of "Political Economy" (i.e., "Political Economics") have been and currently are being put very successfully to the test by his former students V. Putin and D. Medvedev. Understanding Sobchak and his political approach to economics (the synergistic cooperation that can exist between Capitalists and their economies and Socialists with theirs) is necessary to understanding both Putin's and Medvedev's actions while they were (are again, in the case of Putin) Presidents, and as First Deputies of the Russian Federation. An example of the influence of Sobchak's (a noted anti-Stalinst) teachings on Putin (as noted in Allen Lynch's book, noted below) is that during Putin's first Presidency of the RF Putin made overtures to the then leader of the capitalist world, George W. Bush and his administration. Putin and his ideal of economic cooperation with the West was rebuffed by that administration. They sent him home, as the Anglo saying goes, "... with his hat in his hand."

It's unfortunate that the article's author's command of the English language collapses when it comes to providing English language references to support statements in this article. Since, with the exception of just one reference (Newsweek, 25 Feb 2008), all the author's references are in the Russian language. And in fact two of the author's references come up with a "Page not found" error. So, unfortunately, all that effectively makes this article one long unreferenced "Personal Point Of View" (PPOV) article.

At the moment I won't go so far as requesting that his article be withdrawn. Not at all. The article is too important an article in its own right. But I will, however, strongly suggest that the author work with colleagues and/or other Wikipedians to add to the noted references in the article with direct translations of the references relevant content, or delete the Russian language references entirely with an attempt to substitute relevant English language references. I should also like to add that the author mentions V. Putin but makes no mention of D. Medvedev (future President of the Russian Federation and close Putin colleague) with respect to Medvedev's important political and administrative relationships with Sobchak.

Along these lines a different set of references and links to English language sources could be substituted by other authors. For example, the section "Emigration and Return" can be edited to note and reference Allen C. Lynch's (Ph.D, University of Virginia) book Vladimir Putin and Russian Statecraft (2011) in which Lynch describes Putin's role -- at very high personal and professional risk -- of taking charge and being solely responsible for the spiriting of his mentor Sobchak out of Russia and into France to escape criminal charges (page 35 in his book).

All that being said, I do hope the author will work to improve this important Wikipedia Article. K. Kellogg-Smith (talk) 14:29, 29 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Good comment! I just checked a couple English language sources, that one by Masha Gessen and a book by famous Arkady Vaksberg. Both claim that Sobchak was poisoned. And of course, the book "Corporation" (English edition) by Felshtinsky and Pribylovsky tells exactly the same. My very best wishes (talk) 03:41, 20 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Reply

[edit]

Reply to this edit. Please see above. Here is - another good source about this (15 Years Later, Questions Remain About Death Of The Man Who Made Putin) and a couple of books by Masha Gessen and Arkady Vaksberg: [8] [9]. My very best wishes (talk) 16:13, 15 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Anatoly Sobchak. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 13:30, 12 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]


parents

[edit]

Father: Polish nationality, mother = Czech nationality. Both secretly/inofficially changed (using documents in blanco) in 1939 because of fear of deportation (Stalin) from their village (or even from the Soviet Union). This wrote Sobchak hinself in his book about his life. And indeed: the name Sobczak can be find very offen in today´s Poland, mostly in the eastern part (but in my ears Russian-like sounding). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.91.219.155 (talk) 20:25, 18 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Do you have a reliable secondary source supporting this claim? Retimuko (talk) 23:28, 18 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Anatoly_Sobchak&oldid=1200136781"